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xs650 > > General Conversation > > I'm just saying... you know > > anyone interested in saving gas???? |
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anyone interested in saving gas????
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royfisk Full Member
Joined: May 24, 2006 Posts: 1597 Location: winchester, new hampshire usa
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Posted: July 7, 2008, 5:54 pm Post subject: anyone interested in saving gas???? |
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check out this website
www.halfwaterhalfgas.com/hydra.php
thinking about trying it on a xsxsxs
_________________ build them , ride them, tear them down, rebuild them, ride them, etc. etc. etc.. They only get better and better |
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kingwj 650Rider Supporter
Joined: Sep 04, 2005 Posts: 801 Location: Delaware
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Posted: July 7, 2008, 5:57 pm Post subject: Re: anyone interested in saving gas???? |
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Let me know how that works out for ya. You think if this was for real this guy wouldn't be worth more than Bill Gates?
A fool and his money.
_________________ Anyone can make a car stop, it takes a genius to make a car go fast!- Enzo Ferrari
1979 XS650F
1979 XS750SF
1972 Triumph Tiger |
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royfisk Full Member
Joined: May 24, 2006 Posts: 1597 Location: winchester, new hampshire usa
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Posted: July 7, 2008, 5:59 pm Post subject: Re: anyone interested in saving gas???? |
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Im not buying anything from him, Ive seen this before and its all in the science of getting the hydrogen out. I dont know if it will work but Im gonna play with it.
_________________ build them , ride them, tear them down, rebuild them, ride them, etc. etc. etc.. They only get better and better |
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kingwj 650Rider Supporter
Joined: Sep 04, 2005 Posts: 801 Location: Delaware
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Posted: July 7, 2008, 6:20 pm Post subject: Re: anyone interested in saving gas???? |
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those hydrogen/oxygen bonds are pretty tough. I don't know of any process that is energy use positive and I doubt this yahoo has solved the problem.
_________________ Anyone can make a car stop, it takes a genius to make a car go fast!- Enzo Ferrari
1979 XS650F
1979 XS750SF
1972 Triumph Tiger |
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Retiredgentleman 650Rider Supporter
Joined: Mar 03, 2007 Posts: 2258 Location: Calgary, Alberta 1978 XS650 SE
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Posted: July 7, 2008, 6:26 pm Post subject: Re: anyone interested in saving gas???? |
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Remember something called "Cold Fusion", well it was just plain bad science. I'd say this is in the same category.
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jimmythetrucker Full Member
Joined: Mar 12, 2008 Posts: 1283
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Posted: July 28, 2008, 9:12 am Post subject: Re: anyone interested in saving gas???? |
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Ads like that have been running in mags like "Popular Mechanics" since I was a little boy. Burning water was one of the "tricks" my neighbor, Old George (I posted about George once, already), had built under the hood of his big Oldsmobiles.
If was as simple and worked even half so good as they claim, there's no way they could keep the lid on it. Every motorist in America would have installed one of those gizmos fifty years ago. My advice, Roy: Play with it all you want to but don't mortgage the house to pay for your tinkering. You're gonna end up all wet on this one.
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krunk Full Member
Joined: Jul 15, 2008 Posts: 75
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Posted: July 28, 2008, 9:28 am Post subject: Re: anyone interested in saving gas???? |
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water4gas.com/2books.htm?hop=notany
There's ton of sites out there for this - so there is exposure, so as jimmy said, it it wasn't a gimmick....everyone would be doing it.
EDIT:
Is that a vegetable jar!? lol
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xsjohn Full Member
Joined: Jul 30, 2006 Posts: 5857 Location: North Carolina USSA
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Posted: July 28, 2008, 10:03 am Post subject: Re: anyone interested in saving gas???? |
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The system has been around for a long time and was used in some World War II aircraft engines. The sole function of water injection is avoiding detonation.
xsjohn
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krunk Full Member
Joined: Jul 15, 2008 Posts: 75
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Posted: July 28, 2008, 10:11 am Post subject: Re: anyone interested in saving gas???? |
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xsjohn wrote: |
The system has been around for a long time and was used in some World War II aircraft engines. The sole function of water injection is avoiding detonation.
xsjohn |
So basically they are leaning out the engines to save gas, and then installing this to stop pinging?
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xsjohn Full Member
Joined: Jul 30, 2006 Posts: 5857 Location: North Carolina USSA
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Posted: July 28, 2008, 10:23 am Post subject: Re: anyone interested in saving gas???? |
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My dad flew the WW2 fighters.....According to what I gathered from the discussion is that it was used during max throttle when someone was on your ass or visa versa......these engines were supercharged and every bit of power was milked out of them and the water was probably used to prevent them from detonating under extreme use........guess when someone is on your ass with 20MM cannons you probably felt like you couldn't twist the throttle far enough.............
But for modern use I would guess the theory would be that a leaner mixture could be used and the water would expand more than air like in the steam engines.......tried it years ago on a Dodge slant 6 and couldn't get any more mileage and I did lean the mixture.............
xsjohn
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Cooltouch Full Member
Joined: Jan 07, 2007 Posts: 568 Location: Houston, Texas
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Posted: July 28, 2008, 10:37 am Post subject: Re: anyone interested in saving gas???? |
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Water injection in turbocharged and supercharged WWII aircraft engines was used to reduce detonation, that's true. But it was only available at max engine speeds, and what the water did was instantly vaporize, reducing intake gas temperatures, thus helping to avoid detonation. The oxygen-hydrogen bonds were not liberated.
A more popular injection method, then and now, is to use water/alcohol injection. The combination reduces intake temps and the alcohol boosts the fuel octane numbers, or so it is claimed. Read more about it here, under "A Brief History":
www.snowperformance.net/
The above technology is supposed to liberate the hydrogen-oxygen bonds in some sort of energy positive way. This has not been proven that I know of in any reproducible scientific tests. If it had been, as was said earlier, we'd know about it. You can't keep the lid on something this basic.
Best,
ichael
_________________ Triple Tuning Forks Rule!
'81SH, '80SG, '78E, '77D |
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jimmythetrucker Full Member
Joined: Mar 12, 2008 Posts: 1283
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Posted: July 28, 2008, 10:56 pm Post subject: Re: anyone interested in saving gas???? |
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Water injection isn't strictly a joke. Gasoline engines run better in high-humidity conditions. This has been demonstrated over and over again: water vapor improves combustion. You get more power from the gasoline you burn. Motorists typically notice (those that notice anything) that their engines run better when they're driving in the rain. BUT (there's always a but) it's only true up to a point, and that point is nowhere near the fantastic claims made by the guy who advertised in Roy's post.
JC Whitney (or was it Warshawsky?) used to sell a "water injection" kit, and it actually did work much as John said. You got a (barely) noticeable power boost, which allowed you to burn cheap, lower-octane gas without pre-ignition, carbon buildup, or associated engine damage.
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jimmythetrucker Full Member
Joined: Mar 12, 2008 Posts: 1283
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Posted: July 28, 2008, 10:58 pm Post subject: Re: anyone interested in saving gas???? |
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I don't know how you could mount one of those gizmos on an XS650. Maybe if you insert a catheter, put the drain tube in the airbox, and drive around drinking beer. . . .
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bulldog1980 650Rider Supporter
Joined: Mar 28, 2007 Posts: 175
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Posted: July 29, 2008, 12:24 pm Post subject: Re: anyone interested in saving gas???? |
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My pops actual made something similar for his two vehicles and they do help out some.. I am no mr. wizard so exactly what he did I can find out and see if it would be applicable to a motorcycle...
_________________ Tenacious and stubborn... traits that can be both good and bad... so the wife says |
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jimmythetrucker Full Member
Joined: Mar 12, 2008 Posts: 1283
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Posted: July 29, 2008, 2:37 pm Post subject: Re: anyone interested in saving gas???? |
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I have a catheter left over from my prostate surgery, if you think you could use it. . . .
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BiffTirkle Full Member
Joined: May 20, 2007 Posts: 193 Location: Virginia
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Posted: July 29, 2008, 5:52 pm Post subject: Re: anyone interested in saving gas???? |
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you know, its great reading this on here. because, if anyone would know if this truly works as these claims state its all the people who have tinkered and applied these "enhancements" to engines. i read the page first before i read the posts, and i certainly was interested, i drive all day long for a living. and if i can cut my fuel costs, i can cut my quota each month and make bigger bonuses. i might be able to finish my damned radiant heat system i started. but after reading all your posts, i see that some have tried it, and now i know more about the process, and what it does and why. thanks! food for thought. certainly entertained me for a few minutes. i am still tempted to try it. what could it hurt?
_________________ Biff Tirkle is a fictional name. can someone tell me how to change my user name? damnit!! |
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kingwj 650Rider Supporter
Joined: Sep 04, 2005 Posts: 801 Location: Delaware
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Posted: July 29, 2008, 7:52 pm Post subject: Re: anyone interested in saving gas???? |
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It takes a lot more energy to crack water than it produces. If it was the other way around we'd all be driving hydrogen cars.
no free lunches.
_________________ Anyone can make a car stop, it takes a genius to make a car go fast!- Enzo Ferrari
1979 XS650F
1979 XS750SF
1972 Triumph Tiger |
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xsleo Full Member
Joined: Oct 28, 2007 Posts: 1528 Location: Earlville NY
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Posted: August 3, 2008, 2:21 pm Post subject: Re: anyone interested in saving gas???? |
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if i remember right , in high school science class we did experiments where we used a dry cell battery to send a current through water. at one electrode hydrogen bubbles rose, and the other electrode oxygen bubbles rose. not to high tech. thats probably how the system makes the hydrogen. then engine vaccum draws the hydrogen into the engine.
_________________ "You live more in five minutes on a bike than most people do in there whole life"
'75 XS650B with a 79 dual disc front end, rear disk brake, Chrysler reg, Radio Shack rect, LED tail/ brake and turn signals. |
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xsjohn Full Member
Joined: Jul 30, 2006 Posts: 5857 Location: North Carolina USSA
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Posted: August 3, 2008, 2:28 pm Post subject: Re: anyone interested in saving gas???? |
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Way better gas mileage can be had from these by setting them up like a normal engine.....already done it for myself........uncharted territory so I had to figure it out myself......and my cost was "nothing"......
xsjohn
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.ET. Full Member
Joined: Jul 22, 2008 Posts: 28
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Posted: August 3, 2008, 3:05 pm Post subject: Re: anyone interested in saving gas???? |
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There is a gadget invented here in florida that actualy uses water and breaks it down into hydrogen...... I've been told that it works on the same principle as the new honda hydrogen car..... I get about 50MPG on my xs these old bikes can really be tuned to conserve gas.....I work 77 miles away and i get there and home on a 2.8 gallon tank!.... I put back the stock jets and run her a lil lean.
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xsjohn Full Member
Joined: Jul 30, 2006 Posts: 5857 Location: North Carolina USSA
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Posted: August 3, 2008, 3:16 pm Post subject: Re: anyone interested in saving gas???? |
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Tried that myself for years.......not good for the engine .......and there is a much better way to boost mileage without engine trama ...and lean won't get you better mileage because it requires more throttle with bad mixtures....the answer is set it up like a normal engine.......not all the retarded valves and advanced timing for high end horsepower then ride around conservative on a totally set up wrong contraption turning the hell out of it.........
and what you end up with is something that actually runs better after getting rid of these built in delimas that can't be tuned out no matter how hard one tries.......wallah......
xsjohn
Last edited by xsjohn on August 3, 2008, 3:31 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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gs1327 650Rider Supporter
Joined: Feb 20, 2007 Posts: 170
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Posted: August 3, 2008, 3:29 pm Post subject: Re: anyone interested in saving gas???? |
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This is hilarious.
this kind of snake oil was being sold in the late 70's, remember the fuel line magnets. There are still people out there that think they work. SHHHHH-don't tell Detroit, it's a secret....................
_________________ Tom |
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xs1961 650Rider Supporter
Joined: Apr 23, 2007 Posts: 1808 Location: uk
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Posted: August 3, 2008, 6:21 pm Post subject: Re: anyone interested in saving gas???? |
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