New to 650 Rider

twinsarehot · Posted: June 21, 2009, 12:18 pm Post subject: New to 650 Rider

Hey 650Rider,

I've been lurking for information, but now that the summer is almost in full swing, I'm starting my project in Providence RI. I'll be asking for advice as this is my first xs650. I think it'll turn out quite nice, I've just bought some performance mods for the front and rear suspensions. The engine had been worked on consistently and skillfully before I bought it my friends grandfather. I'll be starting a builders log and figured it would fit into this forum, thanks for looking.

This is my other bike build which I sold recently giving this project a deep budget.

This is a mock up right before my complete tear down, the frame has been shaved since this, prepping for paint.

rhilker · Posted: June 22, 2009, 7:41 pm Post subject: Re: New to 650 Rider

Nice project. I see you like cafe's. Good luck and we are all available. Excecpt me cause I don't know s***, still learning. XSJohn carbs, timing, gearing and just plain know how. Retiredgentleman is an electrical genuis. 5twins is probably the most technical. Pamcopete for ignition. And check out the vault.

porq_chopz · Posted: June 23, 2009, 9:25 pm Post subject: Re: New to 650 Rider

dude that thing looks sick as hell. LOVIN IT. and welcome to the forum

oldbikenut · Posted: June 23, 2009, 9:46 pm Post subject: Re: New to 650 Rider

Very cool! And welcome to this great site!

twinsarehot · Posted: June 24, 2009, 1:38 pm Post subject: Re: New to 650 Rider

thanks for the welcome. This bike won't really be a cafe build, as I'm looking for something more practical, and I don't really know where to categorize the image I have for this bike.

I'm prepping the frame for paint atm, but I need to weld some tabs onto the frame. Is there anyway I could braze some tabs on? mainly a supporting tab for the fender (not the only mounting point).

acbanks · Posted: June 24, 2009, 2:10 pm Post subject: Re: New to 650 Rider

You need to find a friend with a MIG welder. If you were nearby I'd help you out.

twinsarehot · Posted: June 24, 2009, 2:46 pm Post subject: Re: New to 650 Rider

Well, I have access to a MIG, but it's a pain in the ass to bring my bike there, I was wondering if there were any other ways =]

pumps · Posted: June 24, 2009, 4:45 pm Post subject: Re: New to 650 Rider

Welcome my friend. Lots of smart fellows here. They'll get you going. Like that old Honda.

TwistedLeather · Posted: June 29, 2009, 3:40 pm Post subject: Re: New to 650 Rider

I would try to avoid brazing when possible except for perhaps patching holes in rusty fenders. It's not strong enough to use as a mounting fusion. Mig or a good stick welding with a 7013 or 7018 rod will give you plenty of strength. These old bikes were made from mild steel so they are very easy to weld. If you happen to have any buddies with Tig welding experience, busting the flux off a 70s series welding rod and using it as fill rod for a Tig welder is excellent and leaves a nice clean weld. Good luck, the bike is looking sweet so far.

Butch.

yamaman · Posted: June 29, 2009, 4:22 pm Post subject: Re: New to 650 Rider

TwistedLeather wrote:

I would try to avoid brazing when possible except for perhaps patching holes in rusty fenders. It's not strong enough to use as a mounting fusion.Butch.

It's not the first time I've read a post like this..........So all those pre 80's GP bikes, Colin Seeley, Nico Bakker ect ect ect are no good? They were all nickel bronze welded, from one end to the other! No self respecting chassis builder (in those days) would be caught dead without nickel bronze welding gear!

Yeah we've got TIG's & MIG's and all sorts of different welders these days, but if you can't use them, none of them will help!

Yes you can use an oxy set to weld on your bike, so long as you are sure your up to it! Enjoy

gordo · Posted: June 29, 2009, 4:45 pm Post subject: Re: New to 650 Rider

Hey Twin's, first, I'm in lust for your girl's.OkOk, next
As yamaman pointed out, That was all they had for welding, so, if you are up to it,(a good torch weld need's to be absolutly the cleanest,NOTHING to contaminate the weld), they do hold pretty good. I used to weld up header muffler's that way, for 'street legal' noise limit's on the way to the drag's. Never lost a pipe.Practic first, as I do befor I weld anything together. I use similar type metal's, so I know how the welder is acting that day.So, go to Lowe's & get some iron pipe & weld on some tab's, then try to break them off.If they come off, try again, until you get it good. Remember, it's all about how well it flow's together,,,Gordo

650skull · Support Staff Joined: Jul 19, 2007 Posts: 1186

I bought a 170 amp 6.8kg Cigweld inverter welder, It ciost $590.00 Aus and this thing can weld at 35 amps with a 2.5mm rod on thin mild steel. Thin meaning 2mm. Blows me out what this machine is capable of. Tig and mig are great but the thing is bronzing and stick welding and fusing have been around along time with strength and durability.

Gordo is wright about the practice and the thing to remember when practicing ............if you are a novice the first good weld you do will not mean the next one will be good also.......a lot of practice is required until you get it wright 90% of the time.

Another thing to remember, just because a weld looks good does not mean it has penetration on both surfaces.....Recognizing this is where experience comes in.

For a few dollars and a bit of time, a course on welding is a necessity if you don't have a friend who knows and will teach you how

Teebs · Full Member Joined: Aug 26, 2008 Posts: 255

Skull, your comments here tie in with what I've been trying to impress upon some folks; If you aren't a skilled welder, don't trust your life to weak welds.

Tack weld whatever you need welded and bring it to a professional. It's a small price to pay for your life... or the life of the person you may end up selling your bike to.

I've been welding most of my life, whether it's stick, mig or tig, but I've developed quite a bit of shake in my hands over the past few years, so not only have my welds turned ugly, it's impossible to achieve uniform weld penetration, so I tack weld and take it all to my brother now.

As far as taking a welding course, how can you go wrong? You're going to enjoy it and you'll learn a skill you can use throughout your life. Since all of the advise you've already received is dead on; nuff said.

650skull · Support Staff Joined: Jul 19, 2007 Posts: 1186

Teebs Been welding for years though it is not my profession, i still use it in my work at times. Finally got to by that welder for myself......Ye haaa

twinsarehot · Posted: June 30, 2009, 8:21 am Post subject: Re: New to 650 Rider

Hey, thanks for all the suggestions and comments on welding. Nice thing is, my girlfriend's brother is an engine mechanic for Dodge. He has a nice plasma cutter/MIG welder setup in his garage at home. Besides learning from him, I'm taking some more advanced welding classes at the local steel yard. Like what skull said, I probably won't be putting my life on the line with any of my welds, but they are nonetheless reviewed by more experienced welders.

y project is on hold until they fix the sand blasting machine at the steel yard =[[..

TwistedLeather · Posted: July 1, 2009, 11:08 am Post subject: Re: New to 650 Rider

yamaman wrote:

TwistedLeather wrote:

I would try to avoid brazing when possible except for perhaps patching holes in rusty fenders. It's not strong enough to use as a mounting fusion.Butch.

It's not the first time I've read a post like this..........So all those pre 80's GP bikes, Colin Seeley, Nico Bakker ect ect ect are no good? They were all nickel bronze welded, from one end to the other! No self respecting chassis builder (in those days) would be caught dead without nickel bronze welding gear!

Yeah we've got TIG's & MIG's and all sorts of different welders these days, but if you can't use them, none of them will help!

Yes you can use an oxy set to weld on your bike, so long as you are sure your up to it! Enjoy

Heck, for that matter, most of the brit bikes and Rarely Drivensons were sweat brazed/welded. Those frames used interference fits from part to part in the structural areas and from everything I've seen, they used stick welding where there wasn't interference fit. Like plumbing copper pipe, sweat soldering or brazing works well with interference fits, but I wouldn't trust it with a butt join to the frame for hanging a battery box...but that's just me.

B.

yamaman · Posted: July 1, 2009, 3:53 pm Post subject: Re: New to 650 Rider

I wouldn't trust my bronze welding to hold up a 7/11 store, but I would trust a quality welder to nickel bronze any part of my bike.

Is nickel bronzing the head stem on to the down tubes good enough for ya?

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