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No spark
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cpotts454
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Joined: Jun 21, 2007
Posts: 447
Location: Louisville, KY

PostPosted: August 9, 2009, 6:53 pm    Post subject: No spark

Hey pamco! You unit is great! Its ran fine for a couple months now. But two nights ago I took a date to a Steve Miller band concert at a casino boat about 30 mins from the house. The bike ran great all the way there, but on the way home was a different story. I got about 5 miles from the boat when the bike just died. Not a stutter, just straight up completely lost all throttle. head light and tail lights still worked fine. Well, after finding a buddy to come pick me, my date, and my bike up I got it home. I did some fiddling today and found that all electrical connections test as normal, but I have absolutely no spark.

12.5 volts at pickup, 12.3 volts at coil +, both coil and pickup have good grounds.

Whats next Pamco? Where should I go from here?
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pamcopete
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PostPosted: August 9, 2009, 7:19 pm    Post subject: Re: No spark

Well, the first thing to check is the coil primary resistance. Use your multimeter on the 200 Ohm scale and check between the terminals on the coil. Disconnect the green wire before doing this test.

If you have Mikes 17-6803 coil, then the resistance should be 2.8 Ohms. If you have Mikes 17-6822 coil, the resistance should be 4 Ohms.
If you have the 17-6810 coil, the resistance should be 3.3 Ohms.

If the resistance is very low, like 0 or 1 Ohms, then that means that the coil has shorted. If the coil shorted and you do not have a fuse for the igniiton system, then the short would have also fried the PAMCO.

The PAMCO has a one year warranty and will be replaced if it is fried. The coil does not have a warranty, but if defective, I would suggest that you contact Mike about it.

If the coil checks out OK, then here is a procedure that you can use to check out the system without having to run the engine.

1. Use a voltmeter and check for battery voltage on each of the red/white wires with the key and kill switch are turned on.
2. The dual output coil has to have both spark plug wires connected to a spark plug at all times.
3. To test for spark, connect one of the spark plug wires to a spark plug that is grounded to the engine.
To test for spark without having to turn the engine over, do this procedure:
1. Remove the PAMCO rotor.
2. Remove the locating pin in the advance rod.
3. Reinstall the rotor, but without the pin.
4. Replace the nut holding the rotor on loosely. This will allow you to spin the rotor to produce a spark without having to turn the engine over.
5. Connect one of the spark plug wires to a spark plug that is grounded to the engine, but not installed in the engine.
6. Make sure that the other spark plug wire is connected to a spark plug in the engine.
7. Turn on the ignition switch and the kill switch.
8. Spin the rotor while looking at the gap in the spark plug for a spark.
9. Turn off the kill switch and the ignition switch.

Post back here with your results.

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cpotts454
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PostPosted: August 9, 2009, 7:39 pm    Post subject: Re: No spark

Alright pamco, I will check that out. I did however do my own test. Grounding a spare plug to a motor fin I got a spark once while turning the motor over. I cant replicate it over and over again. But every so often I will get a spark. Does this tell you anything?
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pamcopete
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PostPosted: August 9, 2009, 7:51 pm    Post subject: Re: No spark

cpotts454,

Well, if the coil is shorted and/or the PAMCO fried, you would not get any spark. The spark only occurs once per revolution of the engine.

So, try the test above because you do not have to turn the engine over and run down the battery. A spark should occur for every other magnet passing over the sensor board.

If the problem isn't the PAMCO or the coil, check your kill switch.

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cpotts454
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PostPosted: August 9, 2009, 8:07 pm    Post subject: Re: No spark

Coil has a .004 resistance between coil leads. So I guess I will have to email mike and see if he can make it good or not. As far as your unit, I did not have a fuse installed, I dont remember that being in the directions, but I could be wrong about that.
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pamcopete
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PostPosted: August 9, 2009, 8:24 pm    Post subject: Re: No spark

cpotts,

I think that the fuse reccomendation has been posted, but it is not in the current directions. In any case, just PM your address and I'll send you a new unit.

Mikes is currently out of the 17-6803 and 17-6822 coils. He does have the "Green Monster" 17-6810 coil in stock, or you could go to www.customchrome.com and buy the Harley 17131 coil for $39.99. I use the Harley coil in my '78/E. I used two of those coils in 12 years, so it's a good coil. That coil is also available at most local Harley dealers.

I'll get the replacement unit in the mail to you as soon as I get your address. Should be back on the road in a couple of days.

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cpotts454
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PostPosted: August 11, 2009, 6:29 am    Post subject: Re: No spark

Ive got a Harely dealership down the road from me, I will check out there prices while I wait to hear from Mike. I've been pretty busy just riding the bike and havent cought up with the forums in the past couple of months so I did not see the bulletin about installing a in line fuse for the pickup. I will be sure to install one now though. Thanks for all your help Pamco.
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pamcopete
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PostPosted: August 11, 2009, 7:22 am    Post subject: Re: No spark

cpotts454,

OK. If you decide to get the HD coil, here it is mounted in my '78/E:


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cpotts454
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Location: Louisville, KY

PostPosted: August 15, 2009, 7:06 pm    Post subject: Re: No spark

Are we sure Mikes is still out of the Part #17-6803 coil? I went on the order forum page and it shows to be in stock. I am considering ordering again from Mike, but I am sorta worried about the same result.. 2 months of use and then done.

And if I decide to go with the green monster I need the yellow plug wires, boots, and the crimp ends right? With my plug caps from the regular coil work with the green monster?
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pamcopete
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PostPosted: August 15, 2009, 7:28 pm    Post subject: Re: No spark

cpotts454,

Go with either Mikes 17-6822, 17-6810 (Green Monster) or the HD 17131 coil. These three coils run cooler than the 17-6803.

The 17-6822 coil comes with it's own wires minus the caps. You can use your caps with it.

For either the green monster or the HD coil, I suggest that you get a set of wires for a 1967 Camaro at AutoZone or Advance Auto for, like, $15. The set includes 8 wires with molded on boots and the correct ends for the coil. I did this for my '78/E.

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cpotts454
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Posts: 447
Location: Louisville, KY

PostPosted: August 17, 2009, 12:03 pm    Post subject: Re: No spark

I just want to post that Pamcopete sent my new unit in within days of the problem. This is the kind of quality service that you will receive when buying the Pamcopete ignition system. A++++ supplier.

I just purchased a 17-6803 coil from Mikes, so it looks like he's got some in stock. If anyone has any ideas on how to keep the coil cooler, let me know.

Thanks for the help!

Ride Safe.
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pamcopete
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PostPosted: August 17, 2009, 1:17 pm    Post subject: Re: No spark

cpotts454

Check the web site, www.yamahaxs650.com for suggested mounting ideas that will ensure that the coil can dissipate the heat through the mounting to the frame.

Also, be sure to never leave the ignition and kill switch on as that will also overheat the coil.

I apreciate your patience in geting the ignition back working.

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Last edited by pamcopete on August 17, 2009, 1:34 pm; edited 1 time in total
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xsleo
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Location: Earlville NY

PostPosted: August 17, 2009, 1:33 pm    Post subject: Re: No spark

I have been thinking about raising the tank a bit to allow more air flow under the tank and over the engine.
Some people have been asking about reliability of the system. I have had mine a few months and the only thing I have found Is the screw that holds the circuit board to the plate had loosened.
I found this when I pulled the cover to check on an oil leak.
A bit of snugging up and good to go. If it does it again I'll add a drop of lock tight to the screw.

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'75 XS650B with a 79 dual disc front end, rear disk brake, Chrysler reg, Radio Shack rect, LED tail/ brake and turn signals.
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cpotts454
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Posts: 447
Location: Louisville, KY

PostPosted: August 17, 2009, 6:59 pm    Post subject: Re: No spark

I have had nothing but excellent things to say about the system. Granted the coil burned up, but that has nothing to do with Pamcos system. Every person I talk to around town I tell them about this ignition and recommend they buy it for their 650.
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