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xs650 > > Motorcycle Systems > > Electrical > > electric ignition? Whats the benefits?


electric ignition? Whats the benefits?
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bulldog1980
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PostPosted: March 11, 2008, 4:44 pm    Post subject: electric ignition? Whats the benefits?

I see on ebay someone selling plans for an electric ignition system. What would the benefits be over stock ignition system... (I am electrically challenged)
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Cooltouch
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PostPosted: March 11, 2008, 4:54 pm    Post subject: Re: electric ignition? Whats the benefits?

For the XS650, improved ignition timing, mostly. Possibly a hotter spark, depending on which system and coil you're running.

About the guy selling that $25 set of plans on eBay. Don't waste your money. "Pamcopete," the guy who developed the system (not the one selling the plans, incidentally) posted a complete how-to over at the 650 garage. You can d/l the plans from the guy who developed them for nuthin.

Best,

ichael

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bulldog1980
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PostPosted: March 12, 2008, 4:20 pm    Post subject: Re: electric ignition? Whats the benefits?

Thank You... I will do that...
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xs1961
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PostPosted: March 12, 2008, 4:44 pm    Post subject: Re: electric ignition? Whats the benefits?

Ive used Boyer for many years & will never go back to points.
Transistorised/electronic ignition gives a far stronger spark , both cylinders are timed spot-on, unlike points where the timing is a compromise due to the contacts sharing a plate.
No more condensers and of course no checking/setting gaps every few weeks!
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NateDogg
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PostPosted: March 17, 2008, 8:28 pm    Post subject: Re: electric ignition? Whats the benefits?

I concur, even with my latest 650 that was given to me, a boyer unit was in the first parts order. I'll never ever ever go back to points again....I still have nightmares of lubing the advance repeatedly only to have it never work right...The boyer is simple to install too. Bikes just run far better with the boyer
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bulldog1980
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PostPosted: March 18, 2008, 11:48 am    Post subject: Re: electric ignition? Whats the benefits?

so I just go to boyer.com... I also saw that electric ignition from pamcopet...
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royfisk
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PostPosted: March 18, 2008, 5:33 pm    Post subject: Re: electric ignition? Whats the benefits?

bulldog Boyers are a good choice for points conversions, your 80 has yamahas electronic. which in my opinion and those whom race these bikes beleive that it is the better system. #1 your pickup coil is located on the crankshaft which is 100% accurate timeing always. The boyer picks up the SAME spot as the points do, through the camshaft. which means there is timing flex there, because the cam is driven by the cam chain. #2 I have never had a bad yamaha cdi box. I have had them not work and found that the wires were corroded inside the box. simply open the box clean the soldered joints and reseal the box.
#3 the information about boyer haveing a hotter spark is bs. The coil is what produces the spark not the ignition module. What that means to you is buy a good coil such as a dyna or accel for alot less then the boyer system, and put your money into something that the bike needs.

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xs1961
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PostPosted: March 18, 2008, 5:58 pm    Post subject: Re: electric ignition? Whats the benefits?

True ,I forgot to mention to junk the Yam originals ..
I meant Boyer combined with a dual output Dyna or similar !

Still makes more sense to replace with Boyer parts than near-on 30 year old Yamaha electronic ignition systems though.

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Shannon60
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PostPosted: March 18, 2008, 6:17 pm    Post subject: Re: electric ignition? Whats the benefits?

if your going racing the ARD is an excellent choice if you can find one I don't believe they are making them anymore don't know why it is a a great system that fires from the crank. Probe Engineering also has an excellent system that I am very very impressed with! I used to use the stock electronic ignition but after having transisters fail in the boxes (costing 3 race wins) I stopped monkeying with figuring what was going bad and replacing it and started using the ARD without any trouble at all. the Probe ignition is new to me, I have it on a 277 motor and will be dynoing it later this week or next and am anticipating good results.
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royfisk
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PostPosted: March 18, 2008, 7:10 pm    Post subject: Re: electric ignition? Whats the benefits?

xs1961
send them so called junk boxes my way Ill pay shipping I have 2 projects that could use them. As for the boyer whatever spend your money

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xs1961
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PostPosted: March 18, 2008, 7:36 pm    Post subject: Re: electric ignition? Whats the benefits?

..Err..my point exactly Roy..You cant get 'em. .. Wink
whereas I CAN get Boyer for £85 ( $150)
Wish Id known they were sought-after,Ive thrown out more sets than I can remember...
Which part are you after, the box or the sender/pick-up ?
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NateDogg
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PostPosted: March 18, 2008, 8:18 pm    Post subject: Re: electric ignition? Whats the benefits?

go with what Roy said...I just went with the boyer because at the time that's all I could really find available and was recommended to me by others. Roy, do you think what I did was a waste? I feel like I explored every possibility regarding getting my points and mechanical advance to work right but it never seemed to and I just wanted to ride. Believe me, me and my nearly $300 were not parted easily, but it has been trouble free so far. No more "too advanced" or "too retarded" and no more fouled plugs. Again, I'm here to learn and appreciate all the advice from those more experienced
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royfisk
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PostPosted: March 18, 2008, 10:04 pm    Post subject: Re: electric ignition? Whats the benefits?

personally I dont have a problam with points till about 9000 rpm. I dont know about others but I On the street am only there by accident. As for replacement on points type bikes, If you cant make points work or are incapable of maintaining points then by all means it is your answer. On a bike with factory electronic such as the one we are talking about, I would never change unless there was nothing else, then personally I would put points in and run a dual lobe cam, with one set of points. this will cure xs1961 problam with compromiseing timing. I would use a high output coil. You could add the second set of points, set them, time them. and run on one set. If the occasion where to arise that you have points failure, simply unplug 1st set of points and plug in second set at the coil whalla your back in business. But I have seen people put on 9 - 10,000 miles without even knowing there bike has points before. My choice of ignitions is the factory electronic first and points second. For raceing I am playing with a magnetto in my mind. but thats a horse of a differant color.
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Shannon60
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PostPosted: March 18, 2008, 10:18 pm    Post subject: Re: electric ignition? Whats the benefits?

I also never found that timeing was a compromise with points, but there does seem to be more and more people that are incapable of setting them as simple as they are, me personally I embrace technology and inovation especially when it can be tried on something proven such as the nearly indestructable 650 engine
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Retiredgentleman
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PostPosted: March 19, 2008, 1:18 am    Post subject: Re: electric ignition? Whats the benefits?

Points work just fine................replace the philips screws with allen head screws. You just need to understand how to adjust them. Important to have a strong coil , high quality spark plug wires.
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royfisk
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PostPosted: March 19, 2008, 8:36 am    Post subject: Re: electric ignition? Whats the benefits?

I am not saying the boyer is a bad ignition by any means, it kinda goes hand in hand with other things such as carburators. Every item you buy for the ol girl the cost goes up. Ignition isnt as bad as some would like people to think it is. Personally I would rather put my money in a area that really needs attention. All in all the stock bike is very reliable or they would not be still around in there stock form and get the type of attention that they get. In my opinion the weakest link is the chargeing system, it is marginal. I also think that the chargeing system is cause for a lot of ignition pronlams. Carburation is another area that works at best. This was the smog era for motorvehicals and these stock carburators were never intended to perform well. People have spent countless hours trying to get them to work right and some claim to be able to get them right. But I see over and over these same people still working on them. So in a nut shell, if you were to get good carbs, and chargeing system, exhaust system , mayby porting and polishing of the head, You have just used up 1000 - to 1500 bucks. now add a boyer and where you at? It will not improve performance any at all. It will be maintainanceless. I guess what I am saying is the boyer should be last on the list if funds are available.
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xs1961
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PostPosted: March 19, 2008, 1:05 pm    Post subject: Re: electric ignition? Whats the benefits?

Ive just seen how much you Yanks have to pay for Boyer Exclamation so agree with Roy in his summing-up..
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bulldog1980
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PostPosted: March 19, 2008, 3:50 pm    Post subject: Re: electric ignition? Whats the benefits?

I have seen some home made conversions done and was wondering if anyone has tried them..
xs650temp.proboards29....1141872309
xs650temp.proboards29....1174359645

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xsjohn
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PostPosted: March 19, 2008, 4:14 pm    Post subject: Re: electric ignition? Whats the benefits?

If your factory electronic ignition is working I would sure stick with it....if it's not working I would fix it........

xsjohn
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jimmythetrucker
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PostPosted: March 19, 2008, 5:07 pm    Post subject: Re: electric ignition? Whats the benefits?

I rode my old '79 an average of 4-to-6 thousand miles a year for 12 years. For 9 of those years, the bike was my sole means of transportation. I never had the least bit of trouble with breaker-point ignition. Of course I maintained it myself. . . .
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xs1961
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PostPosted: March 19, 2008, 6:47 pm    Post subject: Re: electric ignition? Whats the benefits?

..Had Boyer on one of mine for 10 years & 18,000 miles...never had to 'maintain' or 'adjust'...Thats all I was trying to say...
So long as I have a decent battery fitted its a 'fit-it-and-leave-it' system
Ive nothing against points , they worked fine on all of my '60's & '70's bikes , I still got them on a couple , nice n easy to fix/diagnose probs but too many working parts to wear out & adjust all the time ...
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